Lecture 1969 Castaneda, UCLA · 1/2

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300:02 I suppose you some of you have read that

400:07 book that written so I thought perhaps I

500:12 should give you a background the things

600:15 that I did not include in the book

700:17 perhaps that would be a good way to

800:18 start

900:19 I have critics that they have you know

1000:25 criticized me for not including the

1100:28 cultural milieu in which this thing took

1200:32 place and I didn't do I didn't do that

1300:35 because I was not sure where to place it

1400:40 the the person with whom I work is the

1500:44 Yaqui Indian is live in northwestern

1600:48 Mexico they are a very peculiar group of

1700:53 people there are 90,000 of them today

1800:57 and they have lived where they are today

1900:59 since before the Spaniards came to the

2001:03 new world the irony I think was around

2101:11 17 18 that they voluntarily know 1680

2201:17 around 1680 they voluntarily allowed the

2301:23 missionaries to come to Sonora

2401:27 involuntarily under when Mission ization

2501:30 listen and they kept the Spanish

2601:33 missionaries for 80 years in them one

2701:36 day they burned the churches and kill

2801:40 them off

2901:42 and ever since that time they've been on

3001:45 their own made a very strange they're

3101:49 making a very strange concussion of the

3201:54 Catholicism of the time 1600 and

3301:59 whatever was ancestral to them in today

3402:03 is this nearly an impossibility to

3502:06 untangle that to disentangle that that's

3602:10 incredible process oh that's the real

3702:13 result but at any rate they involve

3802:16 themselves after they were the

3902:18 missionary expelled in a very what would

4002:23 be yard word they say a total war

4102:29 against the Western man and they have

4202:34 had 100 years for instance solid warfare

4302:41 after Mexico gained its independence

4402:43 they inheritant the yaki problem and

4502:48 they cope with it finally and around the

4602:50 turn of the century by coming moving is

4702:55 in full force they are Mexican forces in

4802:57 taking the total yaki population and

4903:02 putting them in trains and boats and

5003:05 shipping them outside of Sonora this

5103:10 ship to southern Mexico to the state so

5203:13 Yucatan in Oaxaca and there are crews

5303:16 don't one was very young at that time

5403:20 the ones they the man I worked with the

5503:22 shaman worthy he was very young at that

5603:24 time as a child and he was caught in

5703:27 this mishmash in here his father were

5803:33 shipped shipped to Veracruz and then

5903:37 later he moved to Oaxaca so it's very

6003:40 young like they are I feel today that if

6103:47 I want to place this shamanistic

6203:49 tradition and the cultural milieu I

6303:52 would have to make game begin he saw

6403:56 I will have to mix whatever its yaki in

6504:02 something in central Mexico the one

6604:07 learned his tradition or why we want our

6704:10 college tradition he learned his

6804:11 knowledge of sorcery in Oaxaca

6904:14 therefore he goes every year to Oaxaca

7004:17 in order to collect some illusional

7104:19 genic mushrooms they are very important

7204:23 in elucidating his knowledge those those

7304:26 marshes do not grown in Sonora

7404:29 they grow exclusively in Oaxaca in the

7504:31 whole tradition of mushroom the Martian

7604:33 cold comes from that area the the huge

7704:39 source of the cactus look before our

7804:43 william sings they only come in our

7904:45 theory which grows in the northern part

8004:49 Mexico and it's my belief that don't

8104:52 wanna snake again like taking perhaps

8204:56 the yaki format or syncretism since the

8305:00 act is already I made this thing credit

8405:04 process amalgamating Catholicism

8505:07 whatever it was ancestor to them perhaps

8605:09 there is a facility for them at a level

8705:13 to intake from different areas it make a

8805:18 conglomerate it perhaps his knowledge is

8905:22 it could be classified as belonging in

9005:26 essence to the Yaquis it's the yuckiest

9105:29 spirit the Yaquis like I was saying in

9205:33 crafts that you continue this there they

9305:35 are warriors in another turn of the

9405:40 century they were defeated by the

9505:42 Mexican forces in in in actual battles

9605:47 and after they lost the battles then

9705:50 they were the word disintegrated as a

9805:52 nation they stay in central Mexico for

9905:56 for forty years in then other are they

10006:01 after the war your Mexico is a sort of a

10106:06 herald democracy

10206:08 Latins blood nations in the what was

10306:14 very critical of time after the war was

10406:17 what happened in Europe

10506:19 Hitler moving populations are seen

10606:22 displacing them and then all of a sudden

10706:25 the Mexicans realized that they have

10806:27 done the same thing with the Yaquis so

10906:30 they brought him back again to Sonora

11006:33 they rounded up the in him back to this

11106:37 reservation sort of this a large area

11206:41 that they constructed as a reservation

11306:43 in they have maintained you see the the

11406:53 original land the Mexican allowed them

11506:56 to come back again to the core or the

11606:59 ancestral land it is composed of eight

11707:02 towns and they have but by the time you

11807:07 see the Yaquis will run 40 years of

11907:09 Mexicans have encroached on the land

12007:11 they have subdivided it it was open for

12107:17 colonization or something like that in

12207:19 that now that you have the problem you

12307:21 see of Mexican populations living next

12407:24 to two yaki population ray they do not

12507:27 mix and the Yankees are very they say

12607:33 famous for the sense of aloofness it's

12707:35 very hard to get to them we had to know

12807:38 them very hard to work with them

12907:40 it's especially hard for me because

13007:44 although I come from Latin America you

13107:46 know I'm I look like a Mexican to them

13207:49 I'm a Mexican in the column youri's it's

13307:52 a very respective term terribly it's a

13407:56 terrible word and it's very difficult

13507:59 for me to get it will be easier for an

13608:03 American anthropologist for a part of or

13708:07 of a stocks of an anglo-saxon advice to

13808:09 come to the yaki lon Daniel is for me

13908:12 for me it's nearly an impossibility in

14008:15 the only way that I have have waves

14108:17 enter into it is through the auspices

14208:20 one in his son and they have weight

14308:24 tolerate me they don't know what I'm

14408:26 doing anyways you know they they have

14508:29 this weird conception that I may be a

14608:32 spy from an American mining company

14708:38 [Music]

14808:40 and the funny thing is that that mining

14908:42 companies has been trying to get into

15008:45 Sonora to to explore the copper ores or

15108:49 some of the yucky mountains us since

15208:52 1947 the thing that he at least came

15308:54 back and uh the strange story is that

15408:58 there's no mining company that I ever

15509:00 tried to explore the ores it's just an

15609:03 illusion

15709:03 yucky mine but anyway I'm the spire that

15809:07 imaginary company so the young they

15909:12 tolerate me in some way no they did by

16009:18 now I think I don't bother them too much

16109:20 but it's it's terribly hard to to get to

16209:24 know Rhea keys and I think it's the

16309:27 result the the reason for it is they're

16409:30 endemic warfare against the Western man

16509:35 but that's the yuckiest spirit there's

16609:38 there are truly warriors and in not

16709:43 soldiers because they are not

16809:45 disciplined in that sense it's another

16909:47 concept in what I have been trying to do

17009:51 then with a book that I published in the

17109:55 whole work that I done is trying to get

17209:59 into the cognitive system first of all I

17310:04 don't want because that was the person

17410:05 I've worked with NCE by doing that I

17510:09 were being able to determine I see a

17610:13 cognitive map or what is the yuckiest

17710:17 spirit whatever the one talks about as

17810:20 the spirit a warrior spirit but I did

17910:25 not have that a in mind when I went to

18010:29 do my fieldwork this is a post facto

18110:33 upon reconsidering finishing my

18210:35 fieldwork and sitting on my desk I have

18310:38 reconsider the whole process and I have

18410:42 said this is a very good thing if I if I

18510:45 would try to look for a cognitive map

18610:47 it's a totally a post facto rationale

18710:51 what happened to me in the field is

18810:54 something else I went to my interest in

18911:00 no one is a was a fourth Twitter's

19011:02 affair I was interested in collecting

19111:05 medicinal plants when I was an undergrad

19211:08 I was an undergraduate student and I

19311:12 conceived then a way to move in the

19411:14 ladder you see of all the scholarship is

19511:17 to publish 40 and I feel that the

19611:21 easiest way to get something publishable

19711:23 will be to collect medicinal plants well

19811:32 you got to record the name procure

19911:35 you'll dry especially have it

20011:37 identifying the Botanical Garden and

20111:40 write whatever they say about it

20211:47 I thought I was a very clever young that

20311:53 was my interest in but I didn't know any

20411:55 Indians second problem I knew a guy who

20512:00 know Indians dog which let's say in that

20612:07 way so I I had a friend very good friend

20712:11 of mine who at that time in he claimed

20812:17 you know that he knew a great deal of

20912:19 Armenians and plants so I went a payment

21012:22 listen one summer and I stay with her

21112:24 for a long time and I collect the AE of

21212:28 his plants of course in his description

21312:31 then he says you could check this with

21412:33 any Indian around here did I tell you

21512:36 whatever I'm telling you is this that's

21612:38 what they do with him they day he said

21712:41 to me at that time there is power

21812:43 running all for me some crony that lives

21912:46 somewhere around there there knows the

22012:48 great deal about a yachty and perhaps

22112:52 you know go talk to him maybe we should

22212:53 go and look him up so we drove around in

22312:56 Alaska directions and then mislead us

22412:59 deliberately and we wound up in some

22513:02 hills are there no man's land but the

22613:05 times how about time to go home for me

22713:08 so I gave it up in others nicest look

22813:10 for this old for me that knew a great

22913:12 deal about the early in the other so I

23013:15 was about to take the bus to go home

23113:18 when this old man walked into the

23213:21 Greyhound Depot this friend of mine says

23313:28 he went and talked to him this friend of

23413:31 mine had this would you mean have this

23513:33 strange relation he pretends to speak

23613:37 Spanish he says glossolalia if he just

23713:40 talks and pumps

23813:44 and then the over a period here's you

23913:46 know I first was the joke you know like

24013:49 I tagged along you know telling you know

24113:51 answering him in Spanish when he's just

24213:53 you know you mean this

24313:56 Jackson others told me in thanks to me

24413:59 pretending there was a Spanish so

24514:01 somebody else could hear anything that

24614:03 he speaks in Spanish so I first was a

24714:06 job with a he believed that he speaks

24814:08 Spanish it has a really reliever and

24914:13 he's embarrassed me to know him nothing

25014:15 sometimes he gives me a no were people

25114:18 are you know important people perhaps

25214:21 that I I don't want to fool around with

25314:23 him he speaks to me in Spanish or

25414:26 enemies and in that day he give me that

25514:29 he made it he never sees his bitch she

25614:33 went and talked to this old man phone in

25714:35 Spanish laughs I was listening there you

25814:42 know then he was pretty funny when he

25914:45 says preposterous he was making up words

26014:48 then it isn't he left me he he talked to

26114:52 him to eat reports he talked to the only

26214:54 yelling in Spanish he turn around yeah

26314:56 yeah I was standing with his old man if

26414:59 he was laughing you know very funny

26515:01 like I know that he had a nice sense of

26615:05 humor

26715:08 and then I made my pitch my interpreter

26815:13 policy speech by that point I I decided

26915:17 that perhaps that was the man I could

27015:19 turn into a key informant how do you

27115:24 perceive nothing else even experience so

27215:26 I decided that the only way to do would

27315:28 be to sell myself to him and tell him

27415:31 that I knew a great deal about the Yuri

27515:33 and I told her that says listen sis I

27615:36 know all there is to know about the IOT

27715:39 perhaps the big you know convenient for

27815:41 you

27915:42 we haven't Aegis to you with you you

28015:44 talk to me then the guy he loves look at

28115:49 me he just look at me and laugh but

28215:53 there was something very peculiar about

28315:54 it already look now it's not that was

28415:58 quite exciting I thought please you know

28516:00 I'm on a loop persistent perhaps because

28616:03 I'm sure you either crash or you learn

28716:07 very funny mechanics so I'm very

28816:11 persistent and I'm I'm not dissuaded too

28916:15 easily you have to cover me on the hint

29016:18 nice way but this guy stopped me by

29116:22 looking at me that was weird

29216:27 there was something wrong there I mean I

29316:30 feel like recording my brother my body

29416:34 recorded something wrong very weird

29516:39 yeah I'm not given to well I'm not a

29616:41 mystic man at all

29716:43 very pragmatic I proceeded in a specific

29816:47 ways you know I'm not a scared and

29916:49 easily but how could this guy you stop

30016:52 me just looking now something straight

30116:55 you lady

30216:56 he said yes perhaps you come and see me

30316:58 sometime who talk my house and then he

30417:02 then again this son says oh there's my

30517:04 bus you just got out there's no bus out

30617:07 there

30717:11 so I came back to see him because he

30817:15 interesting personally there was an

30917:19 interested person a mystic interest then

31017:22 I came back in him six months later I

31117:24 came back here and moved from Arizona to

31217:29 Sonora you know I found them and we got

31317:32 to talk it was very minimal they a mean

31417:35 woman there's something very peculiar

31517:39 sensation of control about him that I

31617:42 noticed at that time it's very nice to

31717:46 be around one I don't know what it is

31817:50 but he makes me feel complete very nice

31917:55 concise there's no loose tennis

32017:58 there's no Freddy no it's like they shoe

32118:01 unnecessary excitation here he's capable

32218:04 of exerting himself dramatically to a

32318:08 fantastic point which is the opposite of

32418:11 what I find in my time

32518:13 Oh what I am I free I've been described

32618:17 by a friend of mine as being as nervous

32718:19 as the cockroach I'm very nervous the

32818:23 yet there's no conciseness about me

32918:26 perhaps that's the reason why I like

33018:28 don't one I like stature and I came to

33118:31 see him over and over for a pair of a

33218:35 year and I had development in this year

33318:39 this singsong this is Logan every time I

33418:43 saw him I said when are you gonna teach

33518:45 me about the haunting he laughs you know

33618:48 discs are my question until one day he

33718:51 took me up and that was the beginning

33818:55 for this strange thing that was

33918:59 apprenticeship apprenticeship to his

34019:04 knowledge or I became an apprentice

34119:06 not-not-not why though his apprentice I

34219:10 hear but it's an apprenticeship to a

34319:12 system to a way of being in the

34419:18 after four years I would do from him

34519:22 because they became threatening to to

34619:28 anguishing and they are perhaps the ones

34719:33 who are read this book target don't one

34819:36 used three Allison oh Jenny planets in

34919:40 order to teach his knowledge now he used

35019:45 a cactus before when it was called

35119:49 peyote jimsonweed is one of the tulip

35219:52 plants and those are news magellanic

35319:54 margins one of the species one of

35419:57 fourteen species of a loose energetic

35519:59 margins are grown and central Mexico

35620:01 today genus is the last of the now what

35720:08 they what the reason for my withdrawal

35820:12 as I see it today was very simple we

35920:18 have a picture of the world that has

36020:21 been given to us to press this for

36120:24 socialization and then we have a

36220:27 preconception already ingrained in us of

36320:31 what the world is like and we call that

36420:35 reality the reality of everyday life

36520:37 it's the world taken for granted that we

36620:41 assume it's bear in what's more we

36720:46 assumed that we could give ourselves

36820:48 consensus on the elements to that world

36920:52 from now to the day we die and I would

37020:55 like for instance taking this tube to an

37120:58 extreme I don't need anybody anymore to

37221:01 be a person a social entity appeal by

37321:04 myself

37421:05 and I have myself in the idea of the

37521:10 group you your absolutely I'm all by

37621:13 myself in the universe in the world

37721:14 Hawaii is the idea of you investors that

37821:19 allegedly makes a group meaning I could

37921:24 give my cell phone sensors because I

38021:26 have already

38121:27 learn all the consensus that came from

38221:30 you the group at one time tonight

38321:34 prosody store socials is not growing up

38421:36 you know this time I'm an adult I

38521:40 assumed that I need nobody else to tell

38621:42 me what is real so the the the force of

38721:48 the world taken for granted this is

38821:51 tremendous

38921:52 we never download that however under

39021:56 under very precarious time sometimes

39121:59 rust circumstances precarious to

39222:01 preserve it we get two dollars in that

39322:05 is a blast what happened to me was

39422:11 precisely that the one had a steer me he

39522:16 had guided me to this edge and they are

39622:19 the he push me and I won't know I went

39722:21 all the way and I began to down I began

39822:26 to let's say to lose the certainty that

39922:31 the way the world of everyday life is

40022:34 something I could have found for in that

40122:38 courses madness that's really sheer

40222:41 insanity and before I lost my mind I

40322:44 thought I will quit the apprenticeship

40422:51 voluntarily and I never came to see them

40522:54 one anymore

40622:55 and after that I had timed them to sit

40722:59 around him in in rehash my notes in

40823:03 arrange them in quote the arrangement is

40923:07 not mine they arranged everything Harold

41023:10 Lee I presume it is I wish it would be

41123:12 at least the inherent order of some

41223:16 cognitive units which guided the one in

41323:21 order to present his system as a

41423:23 coherent unit in them

41523:28 I saw the one later after I had I didn't

41623:35 see him for nearly three years

41723:36 yeah the book was published I pay him a

41823:39 visit

41923:40 because I wanted to show him the book

42023:42 because I thought I was the right one

42123:44 so I'm like I went to central Mexico I

42223:47 didn't like we have a way to let him

42323:50 know that I won't let him know that I

42423:52 was coming to see him but I did I found

42523:55 them in he wasn't in this town in

42623:59 central Mexico in I took the book and I

42724:01 show it to him and look at it he like

42824:03 flip the pages I got a surge of prizes

42924:07 if I want you to have it you know what

43024:12 we do with paper Mexico ever since that

43124:26 that that time you see ie I have about

43224:30 15 on that clock perhaps you know my

43324:34 fear for losing my mind was a little bit

43424:37 a little bit of an exaggeration in the

43524:42 casino under under certain circumstance

43624:44 knowing who tend to exaggerate our

43724:46 importance dramatically in the duck was

43824:50 one of the occasions for me I felt you

43924:54 know I was losing something terribly

44024:55 important my mind but later on see with

44125:04 three years in between I change many of

44225:09 my views so I have come back again you

44325:13 know to see them one to visit not again

44425:15 love not to participate of his in his

44525:18 apprenticeship but rather to him to to

44625:22 talk to him but it's very difficult to

44725:25 talk to her to a sorceress you're

44825:27 playing you're playing with fire so he

44925:29 hoped median into to following his his

45025:34 wait Oh be look for me I could say

45125:41 perhaps that what's enticing about him

45225:44 is that his view or the world it's very

45325:48 exciting this this is so new it so I

45425:51 feel that so so much more functional

45525:54 perhaps more rational than mine and in

45625:59 the end the lapse of time between when I

45726:01 withdrew from this completely ruin their

45826:03 friendship until Donna went back seaming

45926:05 it I drew a little tired or rehashing

46026:09 myself beginner because that's what I'm

46126:11 condemned to do even left to my own

46226:15 devices I rehash my meaning over and

46326:19 over and I come up with sin with the

46426:21 same result

46526:22 I'm looking at myself and I'm very

46626:25 boring tired looking up

46726:33 that's one of the very key factors at

46826:35 this point why I went back to see to see

46926:39 the money and he hooked me with a wooden

47026:45 abstract this time the first time you

47126:47 know there was I had no idea of what he

47226:49 was doing this time I will fully go

47326:52 willingly I have let him guide me he is

47426:56 interested at this point forming or

47526:58 teaching me the difference between

47627:01 looking at the world and seeing he makes

47727:06 a semantic difference between looking

47827:08 the same

47927:11 now his interest is as I see it in

48027:17 giving me a series of memories of Colin

48127:24 Blanc

48227:26 now when he says for instance now one or

48327:29 that a sorcerer could turn into a crawl

48427:33 he's given me a unit of meaning turning

48527:37 into a crow for which I have no

48627:40 equivalent and his teachings or sis

48727:45 unfortunately to acquire and I said to

48827:48 acquire a series of memories of turning

48927:53 into a crow in the bridge to put its pre

49027:59 suppose that on a given moment my brain

49128:03 is going to assemble all those units in

49228:06 turning into what in the

49328:10 phenomenological jargon would be

49428:12 followed a gloss example I say to you

49528:17 tree

49628:19 in apparently I make sense however you

49728:24 ask me what I mean by a tree I'll spend

49828:28 the rest of my life trying to figure out

49928:29 what I mean by a tree in order to give

50028:32 you is the series of historical facts

50128:36 about a tree you start the Fox that I

50228:38 have learned as I grew up I could give

50328:41 you they are not only of a tree that the

50428:44 works naman but the assumption is that I

50528:47 have never apprehended the phenomena

50628:51 tree it may be there but it looks that

50728:55 has been here because I am interpreting

50828:58 it and I'm interpreting the phenomena

50929:00 tree through a set of precise

51029:04 pre-ordained mechanics preordained units

51129:09 I've been learning to having thought to

51229:13 perceive tree in at this point my

51329:17 assumption is that I had never seen it

51429:19 perhaps I've seen tree once twice but I

51529:23 could tell you in all sincerity that I

51629:25 have never seen elephant because when

51729:29 did I see an elephant when I was we see

51829:31 two years old six months old

51929:33 never the gloss elephant

52029:37 has come to me fully formed you what

52129:41 processes I could say elephant it really

52229:44 makes sense we really don't know that we

52329:49 are now being concerned with that yet

52429:50 the source of fiber we begin we do not

52529:53 like the the gloss elephant to me it's

52629:57 in addition not the gloss tree because

52730:00 it's obvious that I saw trees when I was

52830:03 what two days two or three days or

52930:06 whatever before I learned the growth

53030:09 tree I have seen the gloss room before I

53130:13 became a gloss and my assumption is

53230:16 there are certain time in my life I may

53330:19 have walked into a room and even they

53430:22 have known the utterance room but I

53530:24 didn't know the total gloss room he

53630:28 require a series of memories of walls

53730:32 chairs floor ceiling to complete the

53830:36 goals and what the one is doing as I see

53930:39 it is giving me beginning the process

54030:44 feast of love singing he's teaching me

54130:47 the mechanics of blossom and that's a

54230:50 thesis the thesis that I wanted to to

54330:53 throw out feedback now my point my

54430:59 crucial point is this in his effort to

54531:02 teach me to see the one says the steel

54631:06 consists in training your eyes of course

54731:11 to the users for pollution or general

54831:13 plants the aleutian Evgeny plants

54931:16 allegedly give you the speed to after

55031:18 him wants a fleeting world without the

55131:23 hallucinogenic plant you would

55231:24 degenerate your body will deteriorate

55331:26 you could do it in the terminology of

55431:28 the nasty name the quest of the American

55531:32 Indian quest for visions you could do

55631:34 that

55731:35 the one took me already or ten days

55831:40 to the best of it and then today so I'm

55931:42 working capable seeing anything from

56031:45 here it was just a horrendous experience

56131:48 because I was tired fatigued and I'm

56231:51 weak you see I don't have the stamina of

56331:53 an Indian so I think I collapse after

56431:56 the second day but the thing prolong

56531:59 except for for for ten days and I found

56632:03 that I suffered a tremendous loss tone I

56732:06 lost weight in the first place loosing

56832:10 of moisture and dishes is deleterious

56932:14 there that to total health it no one

57032:17 says that in the other hand in the user

57132:19 gonna lose no genic planet you suffer no

57232:21 deterioration but you have to know what

57332:24 you're looking for like to use an

57432:27 emotional genic plan for enlightenment

57532:30 it's absurd or one terms to use it for

57632:34 kicks

57732:35 applying to yourself because that's

57832:38 holding to you that is eerie irreparable

57932:40 and he will never venture he to anything

58032:46 laugh when I asked him in a war room he

58132:48 is feeling about taking LSD he'd like

58232:52 you know give him something or that I

58332:54 have procured so he watching his melon

58432:57 saloon he said terrorists take it away

58532:59 he didn't want anything to do with it

58633:02 because he had no no rationale for it he

58733:05 didn't have direction for it

58833:08 in the other hand his plans he proceeded

58933:11 to have a very exact Direction exact

59033:14 procedures that he has commanded he if

59133:17 he's at home he's insane so the the

59233:20 neighborhood hallucinogenic plant is

59333:21 essential in seeing because it allows

59433:25 you the speed to apprehend this fleeting

59533:28 world but what is this meaning world

59633:30 what was he talking about I say that he

59733:35 is talking about a process or rege love

59833:39 singing he's teaching me to gloss the

59933:42 same way my progenitors and my fellow

60033:45 men taught me as a child the ordinary

60133:49 glossners suppose there is the name

60233:52 number of losses or like the glossary

60333:55 you see the the name through the number

60433:58 of Greek glosses that we use or is the

60534:02 pattern of gloucester that we have

60634:05 learned and then we apply it to

60734:07 everything we perceive either way but

60834:12 don't want what he's doing now as I say

60934:15 as a social scientist I think that he's

61034:19 teaching me to reward but he are

61134:21 learning the one who see he is alluding

61234:25 that there is possible to see an

61334:27 ultimate reality in that of course we

61434:31 know it cannot be true at least the

61534:35 social scientists no no that's a bank

61634:39 now there is not more reality in it I

61734:43 don't know at this at this moment

61834:46 probably the end result of it all up

61934:50 tables and I'm going to try to apprehend

62034:54 what he called the fleeting world and

62134:57 see that perhaps or find out whether it

62235:01 is really a process of requesting I I

62335:03 hope that I'll be sober enough to

62435:06 realize that it's the process of

62535:08 ignoring well if there is the

62635:11 possibility of seeing or quote seen or

62735:15 apprehending in irreducible reality I'll

62835:20 live a vicars time in his life you know

62935:24 attempted to to to resolve the problem

63035:28 and he found us nothing big he talked

63135:31 about language with the trappings of

63235:33 natural language then I think Vicarstown

63335:35 is dilemma was that he arrived to an

63435:39 edge that it wasn't impossible

63535:43 you have the phenomenon there that you

63635:46 want to describe is the phenomena in the

63735:50 description two things or is the

63835:54 description part of the phenomena for it

63935:57 as a social scientist

64035:59 as an anthropologist I'm going to study

64136:01 primitive cultures but what what can you

64236:05 say about my description in my

64336:07 conclusions about the primitive culture

64436:10 and trying to study is it part of the

64536:13 primitive culture or instead it

64636:15 phenomena in yourself vicar Stein there

64736:18 is no problem

64836:19 he fell to see the trap is no language

64936:22 he he called a natural language are

65036:24 supposed to philosophical syntax there

65136:28 was a time in which the idea was that

65236:31 perhaps we could develop a language

65336:33 which was the exact a language of

65436:35 philosophers and we will be able to

65536:38 agree without doubt about what we're

65636:41 talking about in terms of philosophizing

65736:44 and that seems to be an impossibility

65836:47 the question is that we use language and

65936:50 the meaning of languages arbitrarily so

66036:54 we are filled with words in the

66136:59 Christine's terms and there is nothing

66237:02 in here as the vocalizations so is that

66337:06 all I am just worse Accord to Vicarstown

66437:09 got or we are worse worse worse worse

66537:13 and he saw no possibility of breaking

66637:16 flipping through this barrier or natural

66737:20 language however don't worry

66837:22 very strange this being coming from the

66937:26 outside you see we should tend to

67037:28 believe that I see that only as the

67137:30 Europeans are capable Russian of thought

67237:33 we're the only ones who think the rest

67337:36 of them are greasy Indian nothing but we

67437:41 are not consider them very seriously and

67537:45 it's a very strange development I have I

67637:50 have read in fact you know I haven't

67737:52 finish this manuscript on singing and I

67837:56 like to start by coding in Equus etre

67938:00 Spanish sequences that came to the New

68038:02 World

68138:03 in 1572 the here on

68238:06 fantastic triticeae in how to

68338:08 exterminate idolatry and he says that

68438:12 the American Indians they did they claim

68538:16 to have powers to divine and with a of

68638:21 something diabolic seeds they really

68738:23 succeeded in divining things he said if

68838:26 to his knowledge decides three cases in

68938:29 which he really is divination power and

69038:32 then he concludes with a parenthetical

69138:34 statement he says however the Lord Jesus

69238:37 Christ is missing in this system and I

69338:40 must conclude that is the work of the

69438:42 devil

69538:42 it must be exterminated he throws out of

69638:44 the window but oddly enough we do the

69738:48 same thing today we are scientific

69838:51 methods in the idea of a trivial

69938:54 Marvel's equivalent to how many angels

70038:57 sit in the head of a pin should we throw

70139:01 now because there are meanings in did by

70239:04 some process unknown to me we learn

70339:06 everything that has been done by non

70439:09 Europeans in the realm of the trivial

70539:12 models and how they go like what the

70639:15 American Indian has done

70739:17 we don't take seriously not really doing

70839:19 an oddity but not that serious of color

70939:22 lot of seriousness who serve there's no

71039:25 biggest time never in our my proposition

71139:29 was that perhaps maybe we should attempt

71239:32 to take the series like what the one is

71339:36 Tolkien to me as a man you see the the

71439:41 crux of the matter is that I am a man

71539:43 who's going to die I cannot avoid that

71639:47 before my very short period of

71739:51 consciousness it's terribly important to

71839:55 me

71939:55 and as a man who's gonna die this one is

72039:59 pose it to me is monumental because

72140:02 perhaps to give me the opportunity of

72240:04 breaking the barriers or not

72340:07 language the one that I have been

72440:11 criticized for this book that written it

72540:15 says that it's hardly believable that

72640:18 are that are that media would speak

72740:20 loudly perhaps me I mean did you really

72840:26 say that that was the question

72940:28 and I said he he said that it's very

73040:32 simple the one deals with an area he

73140:37 called C an area of ambiguity from the

73240:41 standpoint of natural language in in

73340:44 that area of ambiguity there are no

73440:47 glosses that he could use to describe or

73540:51 to analyze if there are no glosses at

73640:54 his disposal he has to make use of

73740:57 metaphor than for art in order to come

73841:01 they need in the world he speaks

73941:03 beautifully because he doesn't know what

74041:05 is to do with that area because oh see

74141:11 it may be that that is the crux of the

74241:15 matter in in terms of all the trappings

74341:18 of natural language perhaps we are right

74441:20 to that area of which we are no gloss

74541:23 will be able to flip the coin bypass the

74641:30 in fact that supposedly has finished all

74741:33 the Philosopher's because they all

74841:35 arrive to the same vicious circle

74941:38 some of them are wise post wise not to

75041:41 say let's stop here and let's just

75141:44 consider our games in Santa Ana cause

75241:47 that he says I know that a column tune

75341:49 is right because of animal faith it does

75441:53 the end of it but he doesn't wanna go

75541:56 beyond that because he knows that he

75641:58 will be beginning you know an additional

75741:59 circle going around around without any

75842:02 solution and I say that that stems from

75942:05 the fact that he for all of us we are

76042:08 rehashing glosses that we know so very

76142:12 well maybe aside time to see quote or to

76242:18 envision life

76342:20 the point of view of an alien culture

76442:22 that has given us a solution to just

76542:25 non-european perhaps the one has given

76642:28 me a series of shamanistic glosses or

76742:32 maybe not maybe for his teaching

76842:35 due to the gloss so that's the thesis

76942:41 that I wanted to propose to you for your

77042:43 examination you see what you say about

77142:47 now you ask me some questions you to

77243:14 retask losses or perhaps get you to a

77343:17 point but you don't have to make losses

77443:20 you just have an experience and you

77543:22 characterize this as more exciting and

77643:25 perhaps more rational than your own yes

77743:28 now did he teach you anything that is

77843:31 did in fact you said that you went away

77943:33 from it even though it was more exciting

78043:35 and more rational yeah but have you

78143:37 learned to experience things no no no no

78243:42 I'm what you know I do what I would like

78343:44 to I would like to be see they had a

78443:48 certain level the power of natural

78543:50 language of soul it's so experienced

78643:56 he presumably has some contact with a

78743:58 certainty

78843:59 yeah perhaps you haven't yes maybe maybe

78944:03 the trick is that you see he doesn't

79044:05 have to contend with the richness of my

79144:07 world my world super rich I have the

79244:11 victories of the scientific method to

79344:13 back me up and then in the back of my

79444:16 mind like I've said it's our first day

79544:18 when I get when I ride to station or

79644:21 great fatigue real fatigue when my my

79744:26 maze disintegrates very that was

79844:30 knowledge what do i do I become very

79944:33 religious but like for instance the one

80044:37 who showed me in a very pragmatic

80144:41 dramatic way this deity called mosquito

80244:46 that inhabits the theory popular so

80344:48 rather that you see through the a lovely

80444:51 or that I even touch it it spreads like

80544:53 this blackboard to me it should be

80644:57 proper to say that I'm affiliated with

80744:59 it because the D happens only yesterday

80845:02 no very recently but now whenever I am

80945:05 very tired I become what I call a Jesus

81045:09 boy I fall to my knees now becoming

81145:11 taller Catholic I confess my sins on the

81245:16 works

81345:17 this is friend woman in hidden a song

81445:20 based on this the name of the song is

81545:22 when the potatoes are hacked I am a

81645:25 Jesus boy that that that's the thing you

81745:31 see I cannot break away from the the

81845:34 trappings of natural language maybe an

81945:39 Indian has more facility

82045:56 no no no no no I have not made any

82146:00 relationship at all

82246:01 I like I refuse to see at this point any

82346:05 less because I as you come mom you know

82446:09 you find if I learn a little bit if I

82546:10 start comparing I lose to another and I

82646:14 become they say a bias another will put

82746:24 brings time yes yes I will assess you

82846:30 know I think it's a like I don't know

82946:32 how to I haven't done what you are

83046:34 proposing there but and I would know how

83146:36 bitch that attracted me the only person

83246:43 who ever talked to me about your real

83346:45 language is Ludacris time that's why I

83446:47 like him

83546:48 see that's the reason why I brought it

83646:50 otherwise that wouldn't even bring it

83746:53 into the picture but he's the only one

83846:55 who gave me the clue the entry to this

83946:57 because otherwise I had to accept that

84046:59 my conclusions about my work are not

84147:03 Farida phenomena there they are a side

84247:07 of it and they are truth they are

84347:09 truthful they could really give me let's

84447:12 say the entry to understand the

84547:14 phenomena but are they really are my

84647:17 conclusions really given me an entry to

84747:19 understand anything

84847:20 I doubt at this point there was the time

84947:22 in which I will defend at that point but

85047:25 at this point

85147:25 thanks to live with Turkish time I'm

85247:28 gonna terribleness

85347:30 yes

85447:40 yes certainly

85547:42 how's the fact talking today Allah Allah

85647:45 in the West are the ones be telling me

85747:47 this for years the idea that I'd have to

85847:50 lose importance like the importance of

85947:55 myself is intimately related in my case

86047:58 that's approximately no but in my case

86148:01 twining like wine like the devil you

86248:05 know all my life will be whiny nothing

86348:09 is right everything is rolling this kind

86448:12 of anxiety attached to risk the things

86548:15 that are not these now not in the best

86648:17 terms for me and I think that's very

86748:20 closely related to the idea the

86848:24 egocentric involvement they I'm involved

86948:29 with my important not only in do you say

87048:32 egocentric co-ed no century now see

87148:36 that's indeed the one insisted that the

87248:39 the proper ways to loose importance to

87348:42 lose the sense of importance and he

87448:44 claims to have lost completely the sense

87548:48 of importance about his ego yet he's

87648:52 capable of functioning in the world he

87748:56 factors in the world via another unit of

87848:59 me that is truly a comprehensible to me

87949:03 hold on he has attempted to explain it

88049:05 to me he calls a controlled falling he

88149:10 says that the only way to put involved

88249:12 with his fellow men is through the means

88349:14 of control falling then he told me this

88449:18 in 1964 and I never never never are here

88549:22 upon the idea until now

88649:25 now 1969 only four five month ago I read

88749:29 my notes my old notes I went back to ask

88849:32 them I don't know what is control forest

88949:34 and he nearly fell back

89049:37 I'm so good and then you asked me about

89149:40 that after so many years

89249:42 well if you have never asked me he

89349:45 wouldn't have matter

89449:46 yes yet says I pretend I act as though

89549:50 it is important in an matters he did I

89649:53 know it that it doesn't matter that is

89750:02 the idea

89850:04 he deliberately involves himself in an

89950:09 act in he actually not not in a funny

90050:13 way

90150:14 he actually when he retrieves fell'd act

90250:16 he has no pains no anguish I do the

90350:21 opposite I involve myself in the nap in

90450:24 it that's my work to my satisfaction

90550:26 nice it's like IHS

90650:37 yes yes

90750:40 that's the assumption no I see the

90851:08 missile though I have work with a one

90951:12 for nearly nine years now all I have I

91051:16 have got are blemishes for this

91151:20 methodology by the time I learned all to

91251:24 see I will have the full flash method

91351:27 meaning in my terms perhaps I would have

91451:30 acquired all the mechanics of glossing

91551:35 as a shaman just pulled away so we will

91651:38 make ourselves happy or or perhaps as

91751:41 there to politicians or perhaps you know

91851:44 I learn what he pretends to do they

91951:50 pretended well he pretends that one

92051:52 could apprehend as I said this alternate

92151:54 reality and once you do it everything

92251:57 fits in place then the methodology will

92352:00 be self-evident I don't know I have no

92452:03 idea

92552:08 [Music]

92652:24 [Music]

92752:35 my god perhaps like begin going back to

92852:39 this idea of control falling I asked the

92952:42 one in order to explain this I asked the

93052:44 wonderful if control holy men that his

93152:48 acts were the act of an actor there are

93252:51 no sincerity in them he says my acts are

93352:55 the acts of an actor but they are

93452:56 sincere they then I said I probably love

93553:00 her as well when the director sizes is

93653:03 falling this is all the time who is it

93753:07 what everybody really weird this is

93853:11 Jimmy that you don't care whether I live

93953:13 or die with a learn or not flip Jesus no

94053:17 I don't care

94153:19 and that really struck me you know like

94253:21 that I knew bricks because I have you

94353:25 know being a very European unfortunately

94453:27 European I have learned to move in terms

94553:30 of being liked or disliked if somebody

94653:35 likes me personally I feel fine and

94753:37 gorgeous if they dislike me on terror

94853:40 and I believed I don't one liked me

94953:43 personally

95053:44 therefore I trusted him and upon

95153:49 learning that he didn't really care

95253:53 here this is the Koran dozen roses set

95353:56 on me now I really feel really lost and

95454:00 I said but why do you want to teach me

95554:02 them he says I don't I don't care it's

95654:06 not my doing since you were pointed out

95754:08 to me by this day at the containment

95854:13 aortic he says I don't know his reasons

95954:16 he must have some reasons for it

96054:19 therefore is it's not on his business we

96154:22 know what the ones business is to

96254:25 acknowledge this supernatural omen and

96354:29 proceed according to his beliefs to see

96454:32 that you have to transmit it but it's

96554:36 not not really his will is not his

96654:39 malicious and the reason why I am NOT

96754:43 they say perhaps the trappings of the

96854:46 European my European socialization are

96954:49 my Western man socialization are so

97054:52 profound that there's no way to break

97154:55 them except intellectually now if I if I

97254:58 knew that I'm going to spend my life in

97355:00 a classroom teaching never again end up

97455:04 in the desert I could say anything I

97555:06 want but you see after I'll talk to you

97655:10 next week I'm gonna see the one in a

97755:12 beginning this map again something the

97855:15 tremendum I cannot lie you see I I don't

97955:18 feel like in the capacity to construct

98055:20 anything on my own

98155:23 and if I don't understand if I'm not

98255:25 here no affinity to the day at least

98355:29 he's talking about I better say that I

98455:32 have no affinity to them because this is

98555:35 something that is being they are not

98655:37 sure for me

98755:39 maybe not the questionnaire with

98855:45 what you say or what you were about

98955:49 other people and that they act that he's

99055:52 going doing us are sort of absurd

99155:56 happenings like maybe they tend to

99256:00 century literature presents happening no

99356:14 I think you know maybe you know maybe we

99456:17 could find let's say an attempt to an

99556:19 explanation in the in the mythology of

99656:21 the Siberian from where the word

99756:24 shamanism comes in and a legend a tunnel

99856:27 syndrome of shamanism

99956:29 maybe yes I'm very they have the tale

100056:33 you know that a shaman goes to the

100156:35 nether world before he becomes a shaman

100256:37 finds the new spirit helper a spirit

100356:40 helper that kills him dismembers him in

100456:44 boils or eat so different processes the

100556:47 flesh out of his bones

100656:49 and once the bones are clean of flesh he

100756:53 has temples and back and pulls the man

100856:55 again into the world as a non man what

100956:59 would really perhaps pertinent wouldn't

101057:01 be to explain that in terms of meaning

101157:03 what will happen to a sorcerer if he

101257:06 rubs and legions to me if he learns to

101357:11 subtract allegiance

101457:13 he becomes the dehumanized person no

101557:17 longer human being the brother no longer

101657:20 a person no longer social entity what

101757:24 makes us social entities is that we

101857:26 believe that the meaning of certain

101957:29 things we are a lying to me otherwise we

102057:37 can function we say however the one has

102157:41 no allegiance to meaning he may have an

102257:45 allegiance to a super order I don't know

102357:48 that I really have

102457:51 my judgment would be that his

102557:53 allegiances to the to the superorder the

102657:55 shamanistic superorder but i have

102757:59 probable in that lying he says that

102858:02 that's not so that he has no one legion

102958:05 and nothing nothing is more important

103058:09 than anything else

103158:12 ingesting nothing is more important i

103258:14 say when he said that i said do you mean

103358:18 that everything is worthless because

103458:21 that's my cognitive reaction if nothing

103558:25 is not important

103658:27 something is equally important unease

103758:29 awareness he says no I didn't mean words

103858:31 I mean unimportant things were

103958:34 unimportant because they were equal

104058:37 that's only through the through the

104158:40 offices of control folly he couldn't

104258:43 bark himself in interaction that's the

104358:47 me it's a very difficult thing I have

104458:48 not really understood what he meant I

104558:51 have I'm rendering as exact as possible

104658:55 what he said and hoped I be able to come

104758:58 up with some

104859:02 what's my wife well I am subscribed by

104959:07 by this astrology I say as they are

105059:10 what's called its structure freak I'm a

105159:13 Capricorn he says that because I

105259:15 strapped your freaks weak men strong

105359:19 women

105459:20 [Music]

105559:27 no I'm very serious because VI rginia

105659:30 would like to get you see I really don't

105759:40 understand how one really divest

105859:45 intellectually of course I do the same

105959:47 thing that you do I understand why don't

106059:49 one saying he's very likely something

106159:51 does they meet to me however let me

106259:55 proceed them in embark myself in control

106359:58 Polly and I fall flat on my face because

106460:01 I cannot rub importance to things I

106560:05 become passionately involved

106660:32 the arm of the aren't maybe I didn't I

106760:37 didn't explain it correctly - for me to

106860:46 know something means that I could repeat

106960:49 that at any given moment and if I want

107060:54 to proceed exercising control for me I

107160:56 couldn't even go to the corner I get

107260:58 trapped and meaning immediately upon my

107361:01 migraines cause what I cannot even

107461:03 conceive sincerely I cannot conceive one

107561:06 instance in which I did not find the the

107661:10 instance meaningful that's what I meant

107761:15 to say

107861:25 Joy's

107961:28 following

108061:33 it's nothing like that it's arbitrary in

108161:37 the sense that it follows they say the

108261:40 one has already a cognitive system that

108361:43 allows them to choose I don't know what

108461:46 it is I no idea what what he like what

108561:49 guys don't want to make a choice he says

108661:51 that his guide is that he wants to take

108761:55 a bath with Harvard whatever he does

108862:00 whatever the choices has to be a path

108962:03 with heart meaning up and not turn after

109062:06 that is a mineral toward an alternative

109162:08 which we could identify without

109262:11 harassment to himself and then he

109362:15 follows that because there's a it cannot

109462:17 be it cannot lead anywhere anyways yes

109562:23 yes yeah yeah

109662:29 Oh

109763:00 the Christmas

109863:03 is it a question man

109963:12 well that I cannot decide that you know

110063:15 I'm already I have already learned to

110163:17 understand the world in specific terms

110263:20 then whenever you start losing the

110363:25 certainty they are countability

110463:28 for the everyday client reality you are

110563:33 mad

110663:34 that's what I've been told and I have to

110763:37 repeat exactly well I don't know what I

110863:42 don't know how you do you mean to say

110963:46 that perhaps we could set up an

111063:47 arbitrary rationale your if it is

111163:55 madness you see from a stricter and not

111264:00 the only the only level i have this is

111364:02 the European level intellectually I do

111464:09 emotionally I'm still I'm still in

111564:11 Europe for sure Europe yes

111664:19 you start out with your black policies

111764:24 or Methodist preform and all of your

111864:27 velocity impact and filled with these

111964:31 Memphis became data hypothesis with the

112064:34 course planning and you find it in

112164:36 several years be not touched by the

112264:37 culture or the person interviewing with

112364:39 okay bye

112464:40 what you're attempting to do is to sink

112564:43 into it work the world view now what

112664:45 happens if you succeed and utterly

112764:47 sinking into his worldview to your

112864:51 models well it's there approximately

112965:03 perhaps perhaps if we want to be truly

113065:07 scientific think of this possibility

113165:09 perhaps in the evening we could knock

113265:12 the system of grossing which is proper

113365:17 of us the Europeans in then the system

113465:20 of glossary which prefer all the culture

113565:22 with stunning you see where they overlap

113665:25 maybe that's the only thing that

113765:27 previous this is that overlap because

113865:30 I've already room icon step

113965:32 preconceptions the pre judgment about

114065:34 the world is set in me my grocers are

114165:38 there and I'm gonna go in judge the

114265:40 glosses of people alien to me you know

114365:43 my own losses that's absurdity if

114465:49 perhaps you pull up them you could

114565:52 overlap them perhaps somehow maybe

114665:55 there's a it's a way of overlapping them

114765:57 in all that overlap the only thing that

114866:00 could be accessible that's in us that's

114966:05 the the proposition is here party no

115066:07 it's an exciting a least nice and

115166:10 exciting alternative in anthropology yes

115266:23 maybe because I'm short and brown

115366:45 I don't know a lot of features of this

115466:50 man's life but I'd like to ask you a

115566:52 question about it you see and he's a man

115666:58 who knows something about your way of

115767:00 life oh yes and he seems to not do

115867:04 Africa logical research say in America

115967:06 or other places because when he knows he

116067:09 knows enough he's not going no she's not

116167:12 a Europeans he's not interested in

116267:13 assisting elected - would you like to

116367:16 universalize his behavior as his tea

116467:19 behave as a human being insofar as your

116567:21 conceptions of human being behavior is

116667:23 concerned for example one says that

116767:54 you know I he says that his life is an

116867:58 exercise in strategy as opposed to

116968:02 mining which is an exercise and meaning

117068:05 I don't watch you see my unions I know I

117168:08 was there on my my life in a strategical

117268:10 terms that's why you're clever a return

117368:14 away I haven't even got my PhD I

117468:18 download them here to me they're

117568:21 complete idiocy in the sense of not

117668:26 really setting up mind my world as

117768:28 strategic terms for the one that's

117868:30 unthinkable the one who if he would

117968:33 tackle the problem of disseminating his

118068:36 knowledge most he would that go from the

118168:38 opponent of your various strategists not

118268:41 a saint not a philosopher just a

118368:45 strategy playing strike I asked him once

118468:47 you who live so strategically what will

118568:50 happen to you if somebody is waiting for

118668:52 five year rifle with a telescopic sight

118768:55 you see and I was there to ambush you

118868:57 have no chance and he gave me a very

118969:08 exciting unit of meaning not to be

119069:11 accessible think about that because the

119169:15 I am accessible I stuck my neck in

119269:18 Chopin that's what we do we stand in the

119369:22 way we love to be clever

119469:24 no one is not accessible therefore not

119569:27 to be on the road the Spanish

119669:30 translation not to be not to place

119769:34 yourself on the road so I support that

119869:38 he he will not die I don't think he was

119969:41 talking he showed me the president no

120069:42 Mexico but if he does I think is a

120169:45 sporting would perceive again in a

120269:49 strategic manner is that because people

120369:52 have strategies only

120469:54 in mistakes not I know what no I then

120569:57 the only question remains if the means

120669:59 are instantiate with their enemies know

120770:02 that people don't have ends and then

120870:04 they look around yeah you are kidding me

120970:06 what I know you telling me the European

121070:11 Russia Nancy that's what I know what the

121170:14 European it was rehashing you the same

121270:16 thing I think don't one means something

121370:18 entirely different but I think I'm

121470:20 holding you back here please I mean I'm

121570:25 his only thing was I I don't have

121670:28 anything to do so if you wanna leave I

121770:34 mean please bother me you want to say

121870:38 you who asked me I'm yours

121970:42 so yes

122070:49 he would like a teacher what and I think

122170:54 he won't wait - this is the in my case

122270:57 is something for for three years a very

122371:00 young it's a lucky chance you know I

122471:05 don't think you would take it up no no

122571:22 no no he doesn't know any other Jimmy no

122671:27 no no he doesn't know marijuana you

122771:42 no he doesn't

122871:46 yes I tried to analyse and he's not

122971:48 going to analyze what he has experienced

123071:51 because simply I think like I said he

123171:56 has no natural language to coverage so

123271:59 he remains phenomena in myself

123372:08 that's my calling

123472:10 purity money yeah then why I would know

123572:14 how to stop

123672:24 I don't know yes

123772:42 yes

123872:46 they're all they like I have made an

123972:49 acetic shaman I know over yaki channel

124072:53 the man has only one arm then da and

124172:57 then I know now a master tick in the

124272:59 central area of Mexico who's even better

124373:02 than the one he's more knowledgeable he

124473:06 is thoughts of a higher order

124573:09 and he may very well be the various

124673:13 standing man he's 65 years old yeah they

124773:23 do get the energy only meetings they are

124873:25 almost the only people who are tends to

124973:28 be able to meet is a whole Channel

125073:30 I wonder if we shouldn't draw the

125173:34 meeting to a close

125273:46 [Applause]

125374:02 you